Sunday, July 08, 2007


Vern's July Update


Now available at:


Which drew a sharp response from cj3 driver:

Vern has stooped to a new low. It is incomprehensible that the president of a 1.2 billion dollar company (spent) would refer to an accident of a competitor’s product in justifying the delays, mismanagement, missed performance, over budget and still in development aircraft.

65 comments:

Stan Blankenship said...

No mention of progress on Avio NG.

PubGrubber said...

At least we now know the definition of an E-clips delivery. Should there be another round of numbers submitted?

airtaximan said...

Whew!

I was really worried about that registration number size issue!

The 20 projected deliveries in July still don't eat up the planes started in Q4 2006. Plus, they admit to needing more people - man - it’s taking a long time and many hands to non-manufacture these things that were supposedly designed for high(er) rate.

I guess Ng is a done deal, and the past promises for fixes, delivered and NGs are just non-issues for the company and the faithful any longer.

Great news on the registration letter size!

I'm sure the religion is saved.

PS. Vern used to brag about all the money he raised. I guess if they really did raise another $400Mil, its just becoming embarrassing.

I hear there's a new e-clips promotion coming at EAA - a free jar of vaseline will be passed out to any e500 position holder in attendeance at the launch of the 4-place which was developed with their deposit/progress payment money instead of finishing/fixing/ng-ing their planes. Hech, they should get something, their money was called a year ago.

FlightCenter said...

I was surprised that the letter did not provide an update on the plans for training the pilots who will be flying the 46 aircraft Eclipse will have delivered by the end of July.

Bonanza Pilot said...

Stan, whose numbers are we using in picking the winner of the contest? GAMA numbers of Vern numbers..man these guys have redefined everything...including what a delivery is!

Do you guys really think they will announce a new single engine jet at Oshkosh...if so with what timeline? I would think they would just be focusing on getting the first one done...of course if I were in charge I would stop trying to add new features to Avio and subtract a few until I had a working unit...but that is old school thinking.

BigJim said...

I'm curious...Eclipse has been delivering aircraft with a known noncompliance (pitot issue) that resulted in an AD (demonstrated unsafe condition)? I just want to see what the playing field looks like. Those poor dinosaur companies usually have to fix non-compliant hardware before they can deliver to a customer.

Oh, that's right...an Eclipse delivery doesn't have anything to do with handing keys to a customer.

flyger said...

Vern wrote:

"But virtually all newly certified aircraft have had problems inherent in the design that were not discovered in the certification testing."


Translation:

"Despite the fact we claimed to be better than all the old dinosaurs that build jets, we think you should be happy that we aren't really that much worse.

Yet."

bill e. goat said...

"I am happy to report that we met our target for the last two months of the second quarter".

$400 million more infusion.

Guess that translates to borrowing $200M per month.

Right on target!

Think of Slim Pickens waving a cowboy hat. Yahoo- what a ride! Half the fun of the trip is getting there. The other half, well, hmmm...I guess all the fun is riding it all the way down. Happy landing, Vern.

(Wonder if the barometric trigger has probe icing problems too? I'd hate to see any more duds :)

Shane Price said...

'Tuesday'

That's what sums up this entire 'update'.

However, no word on forecast deliveries, which is strange. Last one (almost) contained specific numbers...

Wonder if the new funds are tied up in some sort of performance promise? As in, if the company fails to make x deliveries, the (newer) investors might have the option to hold back?

Also, as Stan has pointed out, no further mention of Avio NG. Do the current and near term position holder HAVE to live with this for a long as it takes? Will some begin to loose heart?

The DayJet position must also be compromised. With each delay in the delivery schedule, the launch gets put back. See the link posted by Flightguy from AINonline earlier today.

Shane

cj3driver said...

Vern has stooped to a new low. It is incomprehensible that the president of a 1.2 billion dollar company (spent) would refer to an accident of a competitor’s product in justifying the delays, mismanagement, missed performance, over budget and still in development aircraft.

There will be accident and incidents in Eclipse 500’s as well as every other aircraft flying. Same is true with other modes of transportation. It is just a matter of time. Whether you are riding a skateboard, or a GV, the risk is inherent.

Vern,

Do not try to justify your failures with the unforeseen problems of others. Learn from others failures, implement the solutions and share the benefits of improved products.

When you say things like “…The early Citation CJs have had well over 100 service bulletins issued to correct design and reliability issues…” it makes me wonder, …if Cessna, an 80 year old company generates this many SB’s, what must be in store for a new company with a dismal performance record?

“…From the time we discovered this problem to having the fix certified will be less then 3 months. In addition, we will have the fleet retrofitted in another 60 days and I have kept all of you fully informed of the problem and progress…”

This problem has certainly been in existence since the first flight. Good thing there wasn’t an accident over the last few years, … just luck or a matter of time, I’m sure.

Black Tulip said...

CJ3,

Right on.

Black Tulip

airtaximan said...

remember,

Vern WAS being honest when he said he takes solace in the problems that existed) at other companies...

This is a "revolution" in aviation, as far as I can remember.

Should tell everyone a lot.

mirage00 said...

No mention of progress on Avio NG.

And that means what Stan?

With every post, you expose your transparency.

“The envious man thinks that if his neighbor breaks a leg, he will be able to walk better himself”
Helmut Schoeck quotes

I remain amused

double 00

Gunner said...

mirage said:
"And that means what Stan?"

Well, I'm not Stan but I think it means Vern doesn't wish to talk about the single most important, furthest behind schedule, aspect of his revolutionary jet. After all, "that's the beauty of the design"; it is whatever Vern says it is on any given Tuesday. Then, perhaps, he believes that RVSM, autothrottle, and an avionics suite is not a priority issue for a fleet that's effectively grounded.

So, what do you think this glaring omission from a Depositor Progress Report means, mirage?
Gunner

Stan Blankenship said...

double zero (as in nothing of substance),

In an earlier discussion, we talked about organizing a debate at Oshkosh; Vern, Ken and other members of the faithful on one side, blog critics on the other.

We could set you up in a corner where you would be comfortable. You could bring your book of quotations that you received for your birthday and read from it periodically.

Otherwise you could sit there rocking back and forth...with a smile on your face...amused.

airtaximan said...

Terrific... a new BS quote from the Mirage that is responsible for the following in defense of his religion:

"According to aerodynamic laws, the bumblebee cannot fly. Its body weight is not the right proportion to its wingspan. Ignoring these laws, the bee flies anyway.
- M. Sainte-Lague"

nice to know he remains amused - I guess its easy to amuse/charm/take money from/ a misguided fool

mirage00 said...

Then, perhaps, he believes that RVSM, autothrottle, and an avionics suite is not a priority issue for a fleet that's effectively grounded.

It's the pitot tube issue that has the fleet grounded. But won’t be for long. Then what shall we all talk about about? Never mind, I have seen the dwindling list many times.

Stan. You know my corner. My bet is you wouldn’t show... or at least have anything to contribute.

I remain amused!

double 00

planet-ex said...

No update on Avio Ng.
No update on the simulators.
No update on training of customers.

Definitely crass and unprofessional for a CEO of a company to bash a competitor by mentioning an accident.

Let's wait and see where Eclipse is in one or two years.

The Real Frank Castle said...

Well, there you have it. A major CEO uses the competitor's crashes to justify his long-suffering company's problems.

Keep on rockin', moo-boy. You never did answer my questions.

So it seems you can't justify anything of substance as you and your peers have so vehemently lambasted the "bashers" for doing.

Many here have their facts straight. You, and other members of the Faithful Fools, have yet to prove anything.

Deliver an aircraft that doesn't work. That's something to be proud of.

Oh, what's that you say, "What do you mean, it doesn't work ? It flies."

Ummmmmmm, yea. Good point.

airtaximan said...

Mirage,

Had anyone said the fleet will be grounded becasue of a problem found in the flight test program (three times), you would have said "no"...

Don't worry; it’s not the last problem we've seen from this company, and not the most important, either. It's just the one you chose to focus on now - the fleet being grounded is not the biggest problem.

I'm sure the other issues are all resolved, "in your mind", anyway.

The biggest issue to me is the totality of all the problems lumped together, PLUS the time it has taken to complete (I won't say manufacture) these silly little planes, with all the money and hype about "higher rate production".

I can't imagine they are hiring MORE people to ramp up production. Perhaps they will eventually deliver (whatever that means in the Vernacular, or the rest of the world) the planes that they took progress-payments for a year ago, and began building almost a year ago.

To me, this IS the biggest problem - it’s systemic. It's not one anyone tat e-clips will discuss, because it involves every aspect of their "project" - I can't seriosly call it a business... sorry. Right now, its an excuse to get money from investors and depositors. Ponzi - pure and simple.

The pitot is just a buried lie from the flight test program - heck - most people EXPECT there are many more of these to come. There were other issues buried...remember? funny, how the list just keeps on getting longer and longer... every one of them was found A LONG TIME AGO, and buried.

Enjoy your auto-amusement - you are in a corner by yourself, wetting yourself over this one –and apparently misunderstanding the real meaning of most of your quotes. It must be nice...

- at the very least, your comments could include "my high priest made a mistake mentioning a death in another companies aircraft - apparently to provide that e-clips is no worse than anyone else."

Heck, we know he takes solace in this sort of thing - instead of producing planes that are finished, high quality and in numbers he has promised again and again for 9 years. I personally think he should take stock in his own failures... and make real improvements...like everyone here knows, ANYONE can get it right after a lot of time and money - he's already proven he can blow the money... he just needs a lot more time, I guess, than what he thought. Oh well. It's not his fault, right?

Funny, too...he makes no menation of Embraer, who is spending 10% of what he spent, on a plane that took 2 years to roll out the door. My bet - the Phenom at 3x the e-clips price will sell 3x the number of e-clipses by 2010...too.

- I'm sure we'll eventually hear Vern referring to accident figures and fatality numbers from the entire air transport industry to defend his company - I only hope he does not ever have to state that his company is no worse than the military.

Perhaps you'll find that amusing, too.

The Real Frank Castle said...

Stan said,

"In an earlier discussion, we talked about organizing a debate at Oshkosh; Vern, Ken and other members of the faithful on one side, blog critics on the other."

I'd show up for that, just to see moo-boy rockin' to oblivion, hands-over-ears.....la-la-la-la-la-la !

That's all he does here anyhow, yawn......well, we could look at the aircraft and booths ,too.

LMMFAO.....at you.

Old Troll said...

While we're all being amused, I have a couple musings to add.

It's most amusing that the acolytes of the Church of Verntology treat every promise as if it's already done. Although the comparisons to Moller may be hyperbole, there are definite parallels in light of Vern's repeated failures to make accurate predictions. He even has to create his own definitions to come close (e.g. "deliveries").

I've also been amused by M00's utter lack of wit when it comes to quotes. He really outdid himself with his latest quote that was directed at Stan:

“The envious man thinks that if his neighbor breaks a leg, he will be able to walk better himself”

It's a hackneyed phrase but I must say that the irony is exquisite, especially considering Vern's latest comments about the CJs. M00 reminds me of the dimwit character from The Great Gatsby who always repeated the news. He would quote intelligent people so that others would think that he himself was intelligent.

I think I'll offer my own quote in response to M00's latest:

"Hi Pot, Kettle here. Hey, you're black!"

The Real Frank Castle said...

Hey, but wait a dog-gone minute!

Eclipse delivered 31 aircraft !

Moo-boy, I'm impressed !

Oh, wait. I don't see any on FlightAware. Surely ~some~ of those would be flying around, somewhere besides VFR around ABQ.

Why's that ?!? HHMMMMMMMMMMMM ?!?

LMMFAO......at you.

FlightCenter said...

If I understand Vern's letter correctly regarding the pitot static issue, Eclipse has completed FAA flight test, submitted the amended TC paperwork for FAA approval, which is expected within the next 30 days.

Here are the projections made in June by a few bloggers for when the pitot static fix would be complete based on Vern's June 2007 letter.

freedomsjamtarts - Sep 2007
bonanza pilot - Jul 2007
alexa - 6/27/2007

Who has got a revised estimate based on this new data?

Gunner said...

mirage said:
"I have seen the dwindling list many times."

I look back to January, when everything was Good-To-Go thru today and I think I will never see such a deliciously hilarious post on this Blog.

Thanks M00....you've finally clawed your way from mundane annoyance to outstandingly funny. I think I see why Vern keeps you on payroll. I also understand the reason potential Depositors are not exactly beating a path to your door.
Gunner

Niner Zulu said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
mirage00 said...

And speaking of that, M00, you don't seem to be able to utter two words without ripping into Stan. You are the easily the most condescending and arrogant poster on this board,

Oh my... now i'm really laughing. Sure, I'm the most condescending.... and what would you call Stan and company? Better yet, what would you call this board? Nevermind.

I remain amused! Really!

double 00

bill e. goat said...

Stan: No mention of progress on Avio NG.

M00: And that means what Stan?

Goat: I think that means there's been no progress on Avio NG.

----------------

M00: “The envious man thinks that if his neighbor breaks a leg, he will be able to walk better himself”
Helmut Schoeck quotes

Nice to know where that quote comes from. I've heard another spin on it (?Not sure if it's a paraphrase, of somebody else said something different?):

"It's not enough that I succeed- you must fail".

Darker side of human nature, I suppose.

--------------------

M00: I remain amused.

Goat: Most Owners-in-waiting remain:
1) without their deposits
2) without their airplanes
3) without too much amusement, I would think.

-------------------

I admire M00 for his spirited participation. Perhaps he can share with us his projections for the next six months?

------------------------

No one can see the future, but trying to out guess Vern and read through the PR smoke screen is what makes this blog entertaining, and yes, educational.

Eeven if we dart off on an occasional "dead end" rumor, there's usually a lot of enlightened discussion about technically and historically pertenient details.

And, I must observe, the "rumor mill" here, while not 100%, is significantly closer to reality than Eclipse's PR.

paul said...

Vern also stated that they can't get the 12 week wonders through the training program fast enough to "manufacture" the "aircraft".
I guess anyone who was there with any experience got smart enough to get a job at a real aircraft company.
12 weeks of edumacation and I be a aeroscene mecamic!

fred said...

M00 ...

you remain amused ??

did you know it was one the last sentence from Hermann Goering (N°2 hitler's gov.) just before commiting suicide ...

for sure he saw how they were getting the rope ready for him ...

still come back to the same point :

they train new staff in 12 weeks , but how are they going to pay them ? (remenber they break even on 500 units)

does it need to make new words or new literracy ?? i thought a delivery is when you open a bottle of champagne with a customer and after drink , see him go for good with his new toy /tool ???

now with Prof. Vern i understood it is just a question of doing paperwork ...?? i guess they are really going to reach full speed production last week ...!! ;-))

and he is bashing competitor for faillure ??? ok , no problem !!!

but the mustang is going(gone?) on a tour around the globe , while the E500 remain grounded ....

you're right vern , you made a revolution thru aircraft industry ... but the dinosaurs are flying ... are you ???

Gunner said...

It really is kind of unbelievable that there is nobody in the Company capable of telling Vern that his constant swipes at Cessna only serve to make him look like a real asshat, speaking from the ashes of a program he is actively burning to the ground.

I swear if this guy wasn't such a hump, he'd be dangerous.
Gunner

airtaximan said...

we'll just call it...

"provisional-delivery"

Ken Meyer said...

gunner wrote,

"constant swipes at Cessna"

Huh? Constant swipes at Cessna? He mentioned in April that the Mustang's defective avionics system was holding up their deliveries; in June he pointed out that Cessna took years to develop as broad a support network as Eclipse will have later this year, and a couple of days ago he pointed out that the CJ had a lot of SBs when it was new.

Three comments in 4 months hardly constitutes "constant swipes." Why do you have to exaggerate to make your point?

Ken

Ken Meyer said...

...and, by the way, not one of those communications was intended for you to read in the first place. They were private communications reproduced here without permission.

Ken

Gunner said...

Ken-
Stop being Vern's personal Butt Smurf. ;-)

Three swipes at Cessna in three or four Depositor communiques is hardly exaggerating. Instead of telling you where YOUR money is going, the guy thinks you're dumb enough to be distracted by historical events in Wichita. Do you think you're that dumb? I don't. Not a word about Avio NextGrift, but plenty of space devoted to finding "solace" at ICT.

I'm sorry if the secret handshake info is leaking out from Cult-Eclipse; perhaps y'all should change decoder rings? Like I said, if the guy wasn't such an AssHat, he'd be dangerous.


Gunner

Shane Price said...

Ken,

Once again, you choose to ignore the principle issues. The July Vern update fails to address several topics which have featured in previous communications. You were happy to trumpet them in the past...

1. No word on Avio NG.
2. No forcast on future delivery, however defined.

Vern must be afraid of something to omit two subjects so dear to his (and, I presume your) heart.

Any illumination on these topics?

Shane

AeroObserver said...

Did I miss something or Did Vern say that the CJ is a "great airplane?" I'm not seeing how that is a swipe at Cessna. This and the comments about Cessna's product support network is more of a benchmark than anything else. Don't get me wrong -- I'm not saying that the Eclipse 500 is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Eclipse has made many mistakes (more than any other aircraft manufacturer in recent history), but at least they seem to be VERY committed to getting the airplane right, even if it means significant modifications for early models.

And perhaps Vern didn't say anything about Avio NG because he's trying to save some news for Oshkosh in two weeks. Manufacturers tend to get real quiet right before a big show, and then open the information floodgates during the show, creating more news than I know what to do with.

I know, the conspiracy theories are much more exciting and sensationalistic. Carry on (literally and figuratively)...

airtaximan said...

Sooo...

No one wants to call BS on my prediction of the next “NG”... the whole plane this time, coming to an airshow near you, soon?

Perhaps y'all know more than me? Perhaps you know it’s true? Do tell.

Anyhow, imagine the audacity of Vern launching a new plane, designed and developed with the deposit-money and progress-payments for 400 e-500's, all the while asking to reduce color copies.

Well, I guess he has no choice, really. He needs ORDERS - so far, he has Dayjet, plus Euro-Dayjet for let's say 2,000 or so orders/options (who knows how many options, really???) and 700 or so orders from individuals - many speculators, included.

Dayjet-Ed says: Don't count any more than 229 plus 70 maybe (options) - we can’t say when or if any of the rest will ever be taken - any of the balance of the 1400, that is...

So, how can Vern ever get close to a normal higher rate production flow for more than say a year? Long term? How can he make an excuse for needing volume pricing on his systems, parts and sub assemblies? He needs another excuse - the e500 excuse is...well...gone. No longer plausible. Done.

I suspect he's known this for a long, long time, already. He's no dummy, he needs another reason to raise more money - another excuse. Another plane, I think…and one with a lot of commonality… more of the same systems, parts, assemblies. Volume purchasing is required for the low cost parts and systems – that’s the revolution. I know they have said all along it was technology, but the technology found its was into the garbage. Vern needs volume, and the e-500 is no excuse for any volume.

Insanity at it's best. Another, similar, lower priced, smaller plane. Heck, perhaps he’ll ask for $20,000 non-refundable deposits, too? Churn up MORE speculators. The price - $700,000, $600,000 in year 2000 dollars? It’s gonna be fun to watch the excuse for more deposit money.

My guess is, he’ll probably try to do something about the tail problems reported on this blog due to Hampson - and go with a V-tail, in keeping with the pedigree of the V-jet, and in keeping with trying to compete with Cirrus - another dinosaur. That will be fun, too – back to the V-Jet, our heritage – thanks to Sam Williams. I’m sure he’ll have the balls, after the scrap with Williams.

Well I hope the depositors are happy to wait and wait and wait some more (from the company that promises to eliminate waiting at airports, this is pretty comical) - while their progress-payment and deposit-money has been spent on building another excuse for lower parts cost and investor-milking, instead of building their planes.

Look for the sister plane to the e-clips, .the e-xcuse to be launched at Oshkosh.

mirage00 said...

The "Basher’s" anger and venom spewed on this board is quite entertaining, yet suspect. With every Eclipse accomplishment, it gets worse. Hmmmmmm.

For those of you who missed this week old Avio NG update.

Avio NG

or maybe this one

Avio NG

And finally for all...

Nothing stops the man who desires to achieve. Every obstacle is simply a course to develop his achievement muscle. It's a strengthening of his powers of accomplishment.
Eric Butterworth

I remain amused!

double 00

gadfly said...

Every time I read the expression “I remain amused”, a vivid picture comes to mind, of another person, who is obviously “amused”:
“They're probably watching me. Well, let them. Let them see what kind of person I am.”
(A fly has landed upon his hand, which rests in his lap.).
“I'm not even going to swat that fly. I hope they are watching. They'll see. They'll see, and they'll know, and they'll say... (as he slowly raises his eyes to meet ours, smirking) 'Why, she wouldn't even harm a fly!' ”
(Is it our imagination, or does Norman's smile begin to morph into his mother's dead grin, as we fade to the final shot of Marion's car being hauled from the quicksand?)
gadfly

Shane Price said...

'0Amused0'

Still missing the point(s). The 'news' you link us to was discussed here days ago. One of the interesting things about those releases was the source. IS&S seem to have approval from ABQ to act as spokespeople on the subject.

I suppose that this will allow the inevitable delivery 'slippage' (which is in the first line of of your link, BTW) to be blamed on a pesky supplier.

Again.

What is REALLY 'amusing' is that your leader avoided two areas that have been part of the spin for some time now. Avio NG is behind schedule. And despite many many orders, no mention of when they will ramp to previously stated daily deliveries.

However loosely defined.

Any thoughts? Even a single, half baked one would do at this stage....

Shane

mirage00 said...

The ramp in production throughput is a result of the tremendous improvement we have seen in our production flow. Our new vice president of manufacturing Todd Fierro - who came to us from Ford Motor Company - was instrumental in leading significant process improvements and industrial engineering efforts. That work and more has enabled increases in both production rates and quality. In fact, we are now consistently breaking our own records for cycle times and quality.

In terms of our manufacturing staff, we continue to aggressively build our team. Our manufacturing training classes at Central New Mexico Community College (CNM) are filled to maximum capacity. We have the capability to train up to 90 people in three separate classes every 12 weeks. This increase in employees has helped us boost our production hours, and we now have night shifts throughout all manufacturing plants.


Shane... what is difficult for you to understand here? Read it twice slowly, that might help. As for Avio NG, the owners received an update on that. It's slightly behind schedule but moving along nicely.


I have a question the dinosaurs here. Why does this blog exist? Surely if Eclipse succeeds, aviation as a whole, should benefit. So why bash?
Oh and please don't preface your answers with "we all do hope Eclipse succeeds". You know what they call that in Texas.

Why should we strive, with cynic frown, to knock their fairy castles down?
Eliza Cook


I remain amused!

double 00

paul said...

In terms of our manufacturing staff, we continue to aggressively build our team. Our manufacturing training classes at Central New Mexico Community College (CNM) are filled to maximum capacity. We have the capability to train up to 90 people in three separate classes every 12 weeks. This increase in employees has helped us boost our production hours, and we now have night shifts throughout all manufacturing plants.

Allright! 12 weeks of training! All experts! There's nothing to this airplane stuff!

gadfly said...

paul

Leave the man (assumption) alone. He dwells in a “fairy castle” (his words, not mine), and meditates on a “fly”. If the man wishes to fly in an aircraft built by “twelve week graduates”, maybe we should just quietly walk away, so as not to disturb his dreams.

As he calls himself a “double nothing”, he’s been completely honest.

gadfly

sparky said...

"The truest characters of ignorance are vanity, and pride and arrogance.”

Samual Butler

sparky said...

"Being ignorant is not so much a shame, as being unwilling to learn.”

Benjamin Franklin

Bonanza Pilot said...

“The intellectual man requires a fine bait; the sots are easily amused. But everybody is drugged with his own frenzy, and the pageant marches at all hours, with music and banner and badge.”

Ralph Waldo Emerson

Black Dog said...

If the man wishes to fly in an aircraft built by “twelve week graduates”, maybe we should just quietly walk away, so as not to disturb his dreams.

12 week grad's = monkeys with machine guns firing at aluminium foil!

Eclipse big production plan was based on the best assets and principle of the car industry, lean manufacture and technology and a fine plan it was on paper but the realities are way off the mark.


The kite is too thin and too small to manufacture to the tolerances stated, in the volumes required that’s not to say they can’t be made they can but not by 12 week grads

The sheet metal parts need skilled guys to achieve repeatability you can't knock them out like tin can's

The machined parts are easier but require very high-speed m/c and expensive fixtures to hold them due to vibration.

When you get good parts you are expecting the monkeys to bolt it all together with self-tapping screws! A la GM or Ford It ain’t gonna happen ITS NOT HAPPENED hence the production programme slippage.

I’m happy to let a 12 week grad bolt the fenders on my Ford and drop an engine under the hood but a/craft assy requires a bit more skill in my book.

gadfly said...

Sparky

‘Strange you should bring Benny Franklin into this discussion . . . a man connected to “lightning rods” (figuratively speaking), “flying a kite during a storm” (not the brightest of his ideas), and “A penney saved is a penney earned” (as in, “no more using the color copier”), . . . that sort of thing. After much research, I have found certain documents that verify the reasons why the citizens of Boston were able to see the Eclipse, in spite of the AD restricting flight to VFR, daytime, etc., etc. And I quote (from Benjamin Franklin’s records):
“Later he learned that people in Boston, hundreds of miles northeast of Philadelphia, were able to see the Eclipse because the storm didn't arrive there until several hours after the Eclipse.”
It’s interesting that in the same document, I learned the following: “. . . during Franklin's final Atlantic crossing, he was still trying to uncover the secrets of the Gulf Stream”.

Go figure!

gadfly

(Banana pilot: I went to Ralph Waldo Emerson Grammar School . . . no drugs, no pageant marches, no frenzy, no music, no marches (and certainly not at all hours) . . . but there was this little "Swedish/German blond that I liked . . . )

Black Tulip said...

The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ,

Moves on: nor all your Piety nor Wit

Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,

Nor all your Tears wash out a Word of it

-- Omar Khayyam

Shane Price said...

0Amused0

Thats the same Ford Motor Company that has set next week as the deadline for bids on a fire sale of the Jaguar and Land Rover brands, just to stay afloat?

The same Ford that lost more money (hardly credible, I know) last year than Vern Raeburn?

I do read everything, carefully, at 400 words a minute. All these two paragraphs you choose to parrot back at me say is....

'Tuesday'

Now, again, s l o w l y just for you.

1. Avio NG?

2. Forecast 'deliveries'?

Why not even a hint? Something funny there, I'm sure you will agree.

Shane
PS I offer more than 12 weeks training to my field service engineers, and my life will never depend on what they fail to do.

gadfly said...

Black Blossom of the Nederlands

Oh My! Did not

Khayyam

understand

that

to read again

one's words

before "send"

would prevent

embarrassment?

gadfly

FlightCenter said...

Here is the update on deliveries based on today's data from the FAA registration database.
Eclipse 500 Delivery Data


The spreadsheet uses the following definition of deliveries.
Deliveries = Transfer of registration as recorded in the FAA registration database.


The FAA database shows 16 Eclipse 500 aircraft that have been registered to someone other than Eclipse and 23 Eclipse 500 aircraft with normal category certificates of airworthiness.

The FAA database shows 11 Mustang aircraft that have been registered to someone other than Cessna and 11 Mustang aircraft with normal category certificates of airworthiness.

mirage00 said...

As expected, my question remains unanswered.

As Ken Meyer so eloquently said "Lots of words, but no substance"

I remain amused!

double 00

gadfly said...

Double Nothing

Your first question was:

Why does this blog exist?

And the answer is:

To turn on the lights, and spray the insecticide faster than the little black things can run and hide.

Your second question was: "Why should we strive, with cynic frown, to knock their fairy castles down? Eliza Cook"

Because "fairies" that live in castles make appearances to the "gullible", that affect the "innocent", and need to be shown for the "sham" of their existence.

gadfly

(Yes, I can say it with less words, but it would not make you very happy.)

gadfly said...

Shane

Ford is just following Wal-Mart to China . . . that is their boast. ‘Maybe, . . . just maybe, Eclipse is considering the same. And, I wouldn’t fight that move for an instant. In fact, the State of New Mexico hits all of us manufacturers with “email”, to attend conferences to do business with China. And, for the first time ever, I see a reason to send certain “New Mexico” manufacturing to China . . . Oh, I forgot, “they do not manufacture anything”. Well, at least, maybe the Chinese can put it together, and somehow “make it fly” (take it as you see it) . . . it’s not dog food or tooth paste.

‘Remember the “Edsel”? . . . the car that was described as an “Oldsmobile, sucking on a lemon?” Well, the Eclipse needs something to sweeten it’s future. The old term, being “Shanghai ‘d” somehow takes on a different meaning. Wal-Mart and Ford seem to like the idea. Somehow, I think that Vern is also thinking along those terms . . . it’s only logical, considering the close association between “Eclipse” and “Ford”. The “Yangtze” probably has many more benefits than the “Rio Grande”. “Made in China” would be a great excuse for the many problems of the little jet. Cheap labor . . . even Albuquerque cannot compete with Beijing.

Another famous quote: “Patience is a Virtue” . . . it took about fifty years, but the Japanese were correct: . . . re: “Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere”!

gadfly

(You young kids probably don’t have a clue . . . but it would seem that Japan (they own China, don’t cha know!) won the “Big One” . . . even the Germans buy “Made in China” . . . now that is funny, in a sorry sort of thinking).

bill e. goat said...

Okay, here's my stab at translating the latest weasel-o-gram into English...
-----------------------
Vern:
"Since our first aircraft delivery on December 31, 2006, our primary objective has been a ramp-up to our production goals".

Goat:
Vern, Vern, Vern- your primary objective since Jan 01, 2006 has been to ramp-up production. Whatever bogus paperwork (Osh Kosh 2006 “Provisional” TC) you had to do generate to “legitimize” it and lock in deposits.

MAYBE the primary objective should have been/still be, to DESIGN the airplane, THEN ramp up production.
-------------------------
Vern:
"In the second quarter we certified 26 aircraft, bringing our total for the first half of the year to 30 aircraft...you will see that we have only reported 17 aircraft for the second quarter...GAMA uses as a measurement point the actual sale of the aircraft, not the certification of the individual aircraft".

Goat:
Okay Vern, I give up. With "2600+" "orders" on the "books", you mean you've “sold” 17 out of the 26???

Can someone P-L-E-A-S-E explain this one to me? (I flinch, because I'm afraid someone WILL have a truth-bending, I mean mind-bending, explanation).
--------------------------
Vern:
"In fact, we expect to deliver over 20 aircraft during July".

Goat:
Boy, you gotta really turn the anti-weasel filter to max to “ferret” out the truth here.

Consider: Someone listening to all that mumbo jumbo about what a delivery is, would have given up, and “bit” on the concluding sentence and though “Wow- they're going to build 20 airplanes in July”.

WRONG. Weasel-speak, for:
We have 26-17 = 9 sitting around (?for what reason?) from 2007Q2, and we're going to "finish" "building" / "certifying" / "selling" / "delivering" 11 more just for the "month" of July.

Okay, we'll "see".

(I still don't get it- “not sold” yet??? What's this, the nutty “bidding” scheme in action- when's the auction over?)
--------------------------
Vern:
"We will continue to notify customers of their expected delivery dates six months prior to delivery".

Goat:
We'll lie to you to lock in your deposit with some B.S. proclamation that we'll build your airplane six months from now.
--------------------------
Vern:
"...and update all customers on deliveries by quarter. The delivery numbers outlined in this quarterly report will also be provided to GAMA...but I wanted you - our loyal customers - to see them first".

Goat:
We want you to hear the bad news first from us, before you hear it from the press.
--------------------------
Vern:
"We completed certification flight testing on the improvements to the pitot/AOA system earlier this week. The FAA testing was conducted in a humid/rainy environment in actual Instrument Meteorological Conditions (IMC) and cold soaking at altitude".

Goat:
WOW. What a stroke of genius. Who could have anticipated an airplane would EVER fly in a rainy environment. OR, amazingly, EVER fly in ACTUAL IMC conditions? Or EVEN get cold soaked at altitude. Revolutionary!
Visionary!!
Stupendous!!!
--------------------------

Vern:
"The Eclipse 500 was one of the most tested aircraft to be certified in the last 20 years".

Goat:
The Eclipse 500 has had the most screwed up development and test program in the last 20 years.
----------------------------
Vern:
"There was extensive and thorough FAA involvement including approval of the test plans for the airdata/pitot/AOA system that resulted in an unrestricted Type Certification of the aircraft".

Goat:
You mean the FAA won't just let you think up fun things to go do on a whim? You mean, the FAA looks at- what do you call them- “test plans”???

Stupdenous!
Verntastic!!

(Oh, maybe they are referring to the test plans that EVERY manufacturer has to submit?).
------------------------------
Vern:
"Yet this problem was caused by fairly unique meteorological conditions that went undetected even though we did numerous tests in Texas, Florida and even the Climate Test Chamber at Eglin Air Force Base".


Goat:
Okay Vern, you've been keeping us in the dark about the marvelous short field capablility of the E-500. Just how fast do you fly it in the Test Chamber- that must be some BIG hangar.

Nice of you to mention Texas and Florida, but somehow, you don't mention the word "rain"? Just a careless omission, I'm sure.

(Hmmm, or MAYBE it's because somebody KNEW it WOULD NOT WORK in the rain? Oh, just a silly passing thought.

"Fairly unique meteorological conditions". Ah, that's it. Just as I thought. That darn pixie dust again. Darn pixies).
----------------------------
Vern:
"Perhaps the fact that we live and work in a high desert environment contributed to the problem".

Goat:
Well, maybe the thin air at that “high altitude” has something to do with the overall progress so far. Wonder if they've tested the baro altitude for below 5000 ft. I'm sure they have.

Ah, in Texas and Florida. Yeah, Everythings okay. Don't worry.
------------------------------
Vern:
"So the fact that the problem went undetected is not the lesson, but how we as a company have responded to the problem is".

Goat:
Okay, I don't think this one can be translated into English. Anyone want to try?

My best stab at it linguistically:
“How we as a company responded to the problem is the lesson. But the lesson is NOT dectecting or solving undected problems”.

Interesting, and revolutionary. Again.
----------------------------
Vern:
"But virtually all newly certified aircraft have had problems inherent in the design that were not discovered in the certification testing. How the company supports those aircraft when the problem is discovered is the important issue".

Goat:
Well, I guess you could just play dumb (wait a minute, you're already doing that), and let planes crash, and get sued, and have your TC revoked.

Or, well, kind of support the resolution, like, the "Dinosaurs" do. Revolutionary, ...well, you know the rest. Again.
--------------------------
Vern:
"We are still on track to cut the performance modifications into the production line at aircraft 39. In fact, aircraft 39 is currently in final assembly with all of the performance modifications incorporated".

Goat:
Another linguistcally intriguing mound of Vernisms. My best translation form Weasel to English:

“We are still on track to do it. No, wait- in fact, we have already done it”.

Vern, why not think big and go long:
“In fact, we did it a long time ago”.
-----------------------------
Vern:
“Things are busy at Eclipse as we continue to accelerate our manufacturing ramp and gear up for another exciting EAA AirVenture show”

Goat:
And what a spectacle, I mean show, it is...

mirage00 said...

Your first question was:

Why does this blog exist?

And the answer is:

To turn on the lights, and spray the insecticide faster than the little black things can run and hide.

Your second question was: "Why should we strive, with cynic frown, to knock their fairy castles down? Eliza Cook"

Because "fairies" that live in castles make appearances to the "gullible", that affect the "innocent", and need to be shown for the "sham" of their existence.


Lame... and transparent.

I remain amused

double 00

Ken Meyer said...

Two days ago, gunner complained,

"They've scrapped the JetComplete pricing and can't seem to come up with new pricing; which tells us that even THEY aren't yet able to predict maintenance costs."

So, I decided to ask Eclipse about the pricing of JetComplete. They were only too happy to provide it:

$149/hour covers maintenance, one-call AOG service, Jepp chart service, XM weather, flightplanning, flight support, insurance and fuel discounts, recurrent pilot training, etc etc etc.

It was increased from the $115 originally announced several years ago, but remains less than the comparable Mustang programs even though that coverage is for parts and labor only (i.e. it excludes data service, weather service, training, insurance discounts, etc).

Gunner, I guess they figure they ARE able to predict those costs after all :)

Ken

gadfly said...

Double Zero

As you meditate on that fly, at least use the Queen's English with some sort of finesse. In other words, come up with an insult that shows true "class". Otherwise, "why bother?"

No one takes you seriously, but at least you can attempt to add to the humor. And that's got to be worth something!

gadfly

(Shucks! We'll try not to make fun of you . . . in a pig's eye!)

bill e. goat said...

Ken,
Thanks for the quote for Jet Complete- that seems like quite a bargain. (Does it include engine reserves, or is P&W doing power by the hour on their own)?

I must express some reservation on the actual implementation, as this quote is from the same company that said 402 in 2007, not that many months ago...

Gunner said...

Great, Ken. Plug that baby right into your spreadsheet comparisons. It's provided by Eclipse, third part thru you....must be true, then. Well more true than the last true number of $115/hr....before it wasn't true anymore.

That's the beauty of the JetComplete program. It promises a new Value Proposition.
Gunner

Ken Meyer said...

gunner wrote,

"Ub, dub, uh, I dunno, isn't it awful, you can't believe those numbers...Eclipse stinks, why would you want one"

I figured you'd have something pretty much along those lines to say, Rich :)

Ken

Gunner said...

Gotta love those substantive, fact based comments. Yep.
Gunner

Niner Zulu said...
This comment has been removed by the author.